Please Note: I received a digital review copy of The Fire, The Water, and Maudie McGinn and was monetarily compensated in exchange for composing and hosting an interview with the author. This compensation in no way affected my opinions.
Title The Fire, The Water, and Maudie McGinn
Author Sally J. Pla
Intended Target Audience Middle Grade
Genre Contemporary, Realistic Fiction
Publication Date July 11th 2023 by Quill Tree Books
Find It On Goodreads ● Amazon ● Chapters ● Blackwell’s ● Barnes & Noble ● IndieBound
Neurodivergent Maudie is ready to spend an amazing summer with her dad, but will she find the courage to tell him a terrible secret about life with her mom and new stepdad? This contemporary novel by the award-winning author of The Someday Birds is a must-read for fans of Leslie Connor and Ali Standish.
Maudie always looks forward to the summers she spends in California with her dad. But this year, she must keep a troubling secret about her home life — one that her mom warned her never to tell. Maudie wants to confide in her dad about her stepdad’s anger, but she’s scared.
When a wildfire strikes, Maudie and her dad are forced to evacuate to the beach town where he grew up. It’s another turbulent wave of change. But now, every morning, from their camper, Maudie can see surfers bobbing in the water. She desperately wants to learn, but could she ever be brave enough?
As Maudie navigates unfamiliar waters, she makes friends — and her autism no longer feels like the big deal her mom makes it out to be. But her secret is still threatening to sink her. Will Maudie find the strength to reveal the awful truth — and maybe even find some way to stay with Dad — before summer is over?
Sally J. Pla
In addition to being an advocate for neurodiversity and autism acceptance, Sally J. Pla is the award-winning author of the novels The Someday Birds, Stanley Will Probably Be Fine, and The Fire, The Water, and Maudie McGinn, as well as the picture book Benji, The Bad Day, And Me.
She’s also co-founder and editor of A Novel Mind, a web resource on mental health and neurodiversity in children’s lit. Find out more here, and follow her on Twitter @SallyJPla.
1. The Fire, the Water, and Maudie McGinn is your third book written for a middle grade audience, following the publication of the highly acclaimed novels The Someday Birds and Stanley Will Probably Be Fine. What do you like most about writing for this age group? Are there any particular challenges you face when writing for a middle grade audience?
Small confession here: When I first started writing my very first book, The Someday Birds, I thought I was writing an adult novel of sorts, a G-rated story meant for everyone. I still think that’s what my books are. When an agent first told me, “No, you are writing in a classic middle-grade voice,” I wasn’t even sure what that meant. I guess I’m really in touch with my inner twelve-year-old, ha.
My characters are all middle-grade, and I deeply love that age, and I do write for this beloved age. I am writing specific stories of certain highly sensitive and different young people bumping up against outside the world for the first time.
But I still humbly hope that anyone and everyone can pick up my books and find some emotional truth in the pages — something their heart can connect with.
2. Throughout the novel, Maudie struggles with ‘words of shame’ – negative and critical words she uses to describe herself, which she has internalized after hearing others say them to or about her. That said, one of the many things I admire about Maudie is her strength and bravery in combating this, as she begins to counter this abuse with ‘good words’, positive words of affirmation, as she describes herself as ambitious, kind, bright, etc. I love the idea of celebrating what makes us strong and special. What are some of the ‘good words’ you would use to describe yourself?
Well, Maudie struggles with self-esteem, because of course, I do too. I am all too familiar with shame words circling one’s head. One of my favorite moments is when Maudie writes her ‘good words’ on the wooden heart her father carved.
What would I write on my carved wooden heart? I think the main two words would be: Older and Wiser. ☺
3. There are few things I enjoy reading about more than a character who is passionate about something and this abounds in The Fire, the Water, and Maudie McGinn! Maudie’s love of swimming and surfing and her father’s passion for wood-working were infectious and an absolute delight to read about. What are some things in your own life that brings you joy?
I am also a swimmer, so Maudie’s delight in the water is very much based on my own — that was so easy to write! Walking by the ocean gives me joy. And writing, itself, of course that…I also play the piano, and can get very immersed in my music – it feels like I’m firing different synapses, engaging a different part of my brain. I also love to dance. I’m the world’s dorkiest dancer, and I don’t care. ☺
4. The Fire, the Water, and Maudie McGinn beautifully explores the concept of ‘home’. Prior to the events of the novel, Maudie considered her dad’s quiet, simple cabin in Molinas home, as it was where she felt safest and most loved and accepted. After the cabin is destroyed by wildfires, however, Maudie realizes that home is wherever her dad is, not a physical place but a feeling or more abstract concept. What does ‘home’ mean to you?
I don’t remember who first said this, but there’s this quote about how ‘home’ is not really the place you’re born, or from. It’s the place you’ve found, the place that makes you never want to leave.
For Maudie, that’s Conwy.
As for me, I’ve lived in so many places. Too many, I think. Now I am finally in a place I never want to leave: by the ocean, a bit north of San Diego, in a very peaceful sort home. I thrive on the peacefulness.
5. From the wildfires in California to plastic pollution in the oceans, climate change and the wellness and longevity of our planet are themes that run throughout the novel. Why was it important to you to include these aspects of the story?
Because it is their reality. It is the world they are growing up in. Climate change is already impacting their lives. Might as well acknowledge it, confront it, talk about it. I hope that doing so, that putting it out into the honest open and treating it like the reality it is, will ultimately help kids cope.
6. Surfing is used as a metaphor throughout the novel to explore ideas of perseverance and resiliency. Etta, Maudie’s elderly surf instructor and friend, tells Maudie that “A good many things in this world are actually not that scary if you let yourself get a good clean look”. Is there something you once feared or found intimidating that, upon closer inspection or experience, turned out to be not-so-scary after all? How do you confront and overcome fear in your own life?
I am someone who has had trouble navigating the world because my brain processes things differently. I have tip-toed through a lot of my life in a state of high trepidation. So I know the feeling well. I truly want to help kids push through that feeling, push past fear. I think all my stories are, at some significant level, about overcoming fear.
Cognitive behavioral therapy has taught me, personally, the importance of looking fear in the face. Turning the scary into the familiar, by confronting the dreaded thing, over and over. As the main character in my next book learns (Invisible Isabel, out in 2024): “The only way is through.”
All my characters face fear. Charlie, in The Someday Birds, forces himself down the waterslide. Stanley, in Stanley Will Probably Be Fine, enters a Comics Trivia Treasure-Hunt. And Maudie learns to surf. Learns to trust herself. Learns there are good people who care. Learns to confront – and reveal – her truth.
7. One of the many highlights of The Fire, the Water, and Maudie McGinn, for me, was your nuanced and empathetic exploration of Maudie’s autism. One of the things that struck me most powerfully was that many of Maudie’s coping mechanisms and behaviours are not dissimilar to how we all behave, making her struggles all the more relatable. For example, Maudie discusses how she often ‘masks’ in public, mirroring the behaviour of others or behaving in a certain way in order to blend in and points out that this is something many of us will do at some point in their lives. We all crave acceptance and belonging and will share or conceal different parts of themselves, depending on the situation and the company we’re in. Can you speak a little about this element of the story?
Most autistic people dislike it when people say, “Well, we’re ALL a little autistic,” because it feels a bit invalidating. When you’re struggling hard with a real disability, and are told, “well, everyone deals with it, too,” it’s kind of a slap in the face.
But that being said, I do believe that there’s a great grain of truth there. Autistic sensibilities are familiar human sensibilities – but dialed up to eleven, made excruciatingly hypersensitive.
Most all of us have felt social anxiety at a party, gotten headaches from construction noise, unwittingly said the wrong thing to a friend. Everyone has at one time or another felt overwhelmed, tongue-tied, or bewildered, or found it hard to think when tired. If you want to feel somewhat autistic, just multiply the intensity exponentially, and make it happen constantly.
I got my diagnosis at around age 54. At that point, I’d been masking my entire life. I’d often thought of myself as a chameleon, anxiously adapting myself to whatever and whoever I thought others needed me to be. Always trying to please, to play the role, while inside, my gears were churning madly, trying so hard to keep on high alert to make sure I ignored the flickering lights overhead or the restaurant noise, trying so hard to make sure I acted just right, just perfectly, behaved wonderfully, did everything right.
There is deep relief in confiding to others about this mask, and in putting it down a bit.
I’ve tried to relay some of this through the character of Maudie, I deeply hope some readers will identify and understand a little better. It is all human behavior, after all.
8. Maudie is a victim of physical and emotional abuse at the hands of her mother and stepfather, and has been sworn to secrecy by her mother not to tell anyone what she’s experiencing at home, despite the fact she’s clearly suffering and in need of help. What would you say to a young reader in a situation similar to Maudie’s, who is scared or struggling to confide in someone they love and trust?
First, let me say that there are far too many young readers out there in situations like Maudie. According to the CDC, at least 1 in 7 children have experienced abuse or neglect in the past year – an underestimate because many cases are unreported. Rates are 5 times higher if there is low socioeconomic status, and up to 10 times higher if children have any sort of disability or neurodivergence. Oftentimes, children don’t even realize what they are going through is abuse and trauma. They are so used to it; it is their normal.
A dear friend of mine experienced physical abuse as a child and spent time in foster homes. When she read Maudie’s story, she cried. She told me how incredibly important it was to have stories that show what it looks like to safely “TELL.” That reassure that there are, or can be, people you can trust. People you don’t need to be afraid of – allies and mentors and loved ones you can seek out, and be honest with, and talk about what is happening.
There are resources listed in the back of the book, and many more online, about autism and neurodiversity and abuse.
9. Maudie challenges herself to learn how to surf and her determination and hard work in order to accomplish this was so inspiring! Is there anything you’d like to challenge yourself to learn or do in the future?
Maudie is captivated by surfing, right off the bat! She just KNEW it was for her. Just watching the surfers made her muscles itch to try. I loved that about her – that fiery spark of enthusiasm.
Right now, the main thing I’m challenging myself to do, is to finish writing my next novel! ☺ But I’m also starting to be interested in sewing and art textiles. I have no idea about how to use one, but I may just invest in a sewing machine someday soon.
What about you? What challenges are you greeting, on this new day, with joy? I hope you find some good ones.
One Response
It was such a joy to work with you on this, Jen!